Discuss mailing list

[<vv AT cgs.pw>]

Your post elicited so many responses because it brought
up a bunch of stuff that didn't make any sense. Perhaps
you like to ramble, and that's just great, but in this
case it certainly caused confusion. And no, that is not
because of limitations of the written word. :)

As for encryption and such, that just doesn't make any
sense in the context of a public forum. I too am involved
with privacy issues, and use Tor as well as other related
technology on a daily basis. Applying such things to our
very public discussions is not something that would serve
any useful purpose however.

In any case Nadia, thanks for clarifying what you were
up to. It's all good. :)

~ Ole


On Fri, 31 Mar 2017 23:52:34 -0000
"Nadia Larsen" <an0n1 AT riseup.net> wrote:

> Joseph Marsden wrote:
> ࿊ I would also have to agree with this, there is no reason
> ࿊ for OpenNIC conversations to be encrypted/secret, in
> fact ࿊ they should be as public as possible for maximum
> ࿊ transparency. Basically everything is compatible with
> IRC ࿊ nowadays and there's no point moving to some closed
> source ࿊ third party application.
> ࿊
> 
> I truly did not think my reply would illicit so many
> responses. I wish to offer my apology. In my statement, I
> never suggested using any proprietary means of
> communication or any proprietary software whatsoever. All
> references to anything proprietary were of an ironic
> nature. I am a long time privacy advocate and myself run
> Linux - Debian to be precise - on my desktop.
> 
> I do tend to be what is considered by many as overly
> enthusiastic in such matters. I also tend to write as I
> think and speak so it can be difficult to understand the
> full meaning of my written words as they do not have the
> inflections that speech has.
> 
> So, I was in no way suggesting abandoning any means of
> communication in use by a community in which I am an
> infant. I was, however, saying that anyone who would enjoy
> using a fully open source chat client that is able to
> encrypt communications and also able to send said
> communications over the decentralized Tor network for
> further privacy enhancementhandles look at ChatSecure, for
> use whenever and whatever they wish. Any references to any
> other clients were made in jest, even Signal, though it
> was quite subtle, hidden in the context of it not having a
> Linux client.
> 
> Again, I was not suggesting replacing any system within
> this community. I've no reason whatsoever nor, imo, any
> right whatsoever, to do so. I do feel I've the freedom to
> openly express ideas I may have regarding issues of
> privacy and / or security, which are the very reasons I
> was initially drawn to the OpenNIC community.
> 
> - NL
> ࿊ -----Original Message-----
> ࿊ From: discuss-request AT lists.opennicproject.org
> ࿊ [mailto:discuss-request AT lists.opennicproject.org] On
> ࿊ Behalf Of Daniel Quintiliani
> ࿊ Sent: 13 March 2017 7:54 PM
> ࿊ To: discuss <discuss AT lists.opennicproject.org>
> ࿊ Subject: Re: [opennic-discuss] OpenNIC Unofficial
> ࿊ Discord.
> ࿊
> ࿊ You can't honestly be serious about moving away from IRC
> ࿊ and the inconvenience it would cause to people? Is there
> ࿊ any justification for leaving IRC? Freenode has SSL, we
> ࿊ have no problems with spam, there is no reason for
> OpenNIC ࿊ to do its business in secret, people will have
> to leave ࿊ extra closed-source programs running at the
> same time, ࿊ which might not work on Linux and for what?
> FOR WHAT? ࿊
> ࿊ --
> ࿊
> ࿊ -Dan Q
> ࿊
> ࿊
> ࿊ On Sun, 12 Mar 2017 18:17:39 -0000, "Nadia Larsen"
> ࿊ <an0n1 AT riseup.net> wrote:
> ࿊
> ࿊> 20 days later... but I must state that I applaud both
> ࿊> Jikan & Fusl for
> ࿊> their philosophies regarding privacy & support of open
> ࿊> source software
> ࿊> in their contained statements. I *was* going to suggest
> ࿊> using Telegram
> ࿊> for its somewhat enhanced privacy & security, though
> ࿊> 100% open sourced
> ࿊> it is not, nor is it actually known to be either
> private ࿊> or secure for
> ࿊> its aforementioned lack of transparency. It's been 50%
> ࿊> so -
> ࿊> client-side code is, server side is not - since its
> ࿊> inception, so I'd
> ࿊> say they've no plans at all on open sourcing the server
> ࿊> side / cloud
> ࿊> based encryption proto, w/e it is. There is, however,
> ࿊> OpenWhisper's
> ࿊> Signal protocol which is open source & is a relatively
> ࿊> private &
> ࿊> secure means of communication. It does not yet have a
> ࿊> desktop client;
> ࿊> however, it does have browser usability. I recommend
> ࿊> using it in
> ࿊> conjuction with any Windows OS & its preinstalled
> ࿊> browser. <-
> ࿊> *KIDDING!* And moving on... Telegram does have a
> desktop ࿊> client, and a
> ࿊> fairly reliable infrastructure for group chats. (Signal
> ࿊> is also
> ࿊> reliable, though its group chat implementation doesn't
> ࿊> have the added
> ࿊> 'eye-candy' that some peeps are drawn to). If what
> we're ࿊> going for a
> ࿊> is an open source, private, secure platform with
> ࿊> self-hosting
> ࿊> capabilities, I'd personally go with the Chat Secure
> ࿊> platform, use its
> ࿊> highest level of encryption available, use OTR
> messaging ࿊> over
> ࿊> jabber.otr.im, duckgo.com, or, if self-hosting, use
> e.g. ࿊> OpenNICideas.o / .libre / .pirate / ...  and *do
> so over ࿊> Tor's
> ࿊> 'infrastructure'*. But I doubt the 'out-of-the-box,
> easy ࿊> to set up,
> ࿊> really don't care about what's under the hood, only
> care ࿊> about looking
> ࿊> at how pretty it is' peeps (if any exist that would
> even ࿊> care about
> ࿊> joining said chat(s) exist @
> ࿊> OpenNIC) would even bother to give it a look.
> ࿊>
> ࿊> Belatedly & with respect,
> ࿊> ~ NL
> ࿊>
> ࿊>
> ࿊>
> ࿊> Jikan wrote:
> ࿊> # Did anyone actually read Discord's privacy policy?
> ࿊> # ⇒ https://discordapp.com/privacy
> ࿊> # Sorry, but I can't support that.
> ࿊> #
> ࿊> # TL;DR: "Information we collect may include but not be
> ࿊> limited to #
> ࿊> username, email address, and any messages, images or
> ࿊> other content you
> ࿊> # send […] we receive and store certain information
> such ࿊> as an IP
> ࿊> address, # device ID, and your activities […] such
> ࿊> information may be
> ࿊> included in # databases owned and maintained by
> ࿊> affiliates, agents or
> ࿊> service # providers […] you may connect a social
> ࿊> networking service
> ࿊> ("SNS") such # as Facebook or Twitter to your Discord
> ࿊> account. When
> ࿊> you do this, it # allows us to obtain information from
> ࿊> those accounts
> ࿊> (for example, your # friends or contacts). […] we use
> ࿊> Google Analytics
> ࿊> […]  Mixpanel # Analytics […] Bugsnag […]" etc.
> ࿊> #
> ࿊> # Le 21/02/2017 à 00:08, Jonah Aragon a écrit :  
> ࿊> #> Want to maybe take an actual look at Matrix first?  
> ࿊> https://matrix.org/ #> #> Jonah #> #> On Mon, Feb 20,
> ࿊> 2017 at 5:05 PM
> ࿊> Theo B <me AT theos.space> wrote:  
> ࿊> #>
> ࿊> #>     I think we should stay (as Fusl said) to the
> open ࿊> source things
> ࿊> that #>     we have available right now, as those seem
> ࿊> to be the ones
> ࿊> that most #>     people are easily able to use. Those
> ࿊> being IRC, the ML,
> ࿊> and Mumble. #>  
> ࿊> #>     On Mon, Feb 20, 2017 at 5:10 PM, Jonah Aragon  
> ࿊> <jonaharagon AT gmail.com #>
> ࿊> <mailto:jonaharagon AT gmail.com>> wrote: #>  
> ࿊> #>         In the approximately 10 seconds since I
> sent ࿊> my last email,
> ࿊> I've #>         had some time to think about Matrix and
> ࿊> how well it might
> ࿊> work #>         for us. I'm going to try setting up a
> ࿊> Synapse server and
> ࿊> see if #>         I can get an IRC integration working
> ࿊> :)  
> ࿊> #>
> ࿊> #>         Jonah
> ࿊> #>
> ࿊> #>         On Mon, Feb 20, 2017 at 4:08 PM mk  
> ࿊> <mk AT mkwia.com  
> ࿊> #>         <mailto:mk AT mkwia.com>> wrote:
> ࿊> #>
> ࿊> #>             I definitely think we should focus on
> one ࿊> or two of these.  
> ࿊> #>             We have to
> ࿊> #>             ask ourselves if things like slack and  
> ࿊> discord that do the  
> ࿊> #>             same thing
> ࿊> #>             are necessarily crucial.
> ࿊> #>
> ࿊> #>
> ࿊> #>             On 20/02/2017 21:49, Fusl Dash wrote:  
> ࿊> #>             > Let me just summarize what we have  
> ࿊> available now: #>  
> ࿊>         >  
> ࿊> #>             > - IRC  
> ࿊> #>  
> ࿊>  
> https://webchat.freenode.net/?randomnick=1&channels=%23opennic
> ࿊> #>
> ࿊>     > - Mailing List  
> ࿊> http://wiki.opennicproject.org/MailingLists #>  
> ࿊>          > - Slack
> http://slack.opennic.org/ ࿊> #>             > - Discord  
> ࿊> https://discord.gg/bCKFkN3  
> ࿊> #>             > - Mumble          mumb.li:64738  
> ࿊> <http://mumb.li:64738>  
> ࿊> #>             > - Internet forum  http://talk.geek/
> ࿊> #>             >
> ࿊> #>             > I probably miss something else but  
> ࿊> those are the OpenNIC  
> ࿊> #>             communities that I know of right now.  
> ࿊> #>             >
> ࿊> #>             > Mailing list, Mumble and the
> internet ࿊> forum are so far
> ࿊> the #>             only things which are open source
> and ࿊> self-hosted and  
> ࿊> #>             controlled by the OpenNIC community,
> the ࿊> rest is either #>
> ࿊>             closed source and/or not hosted by OpenNIC
> ࿊> and should #>
> ࿊>        therefore be avoided. We should stick to the
> ࿊> things that we #>
> ࿊>         self host, otherwise "alternative", "open",
> ࿊> "democratic" and #>
> ࿊>           the rest of our subtext on the website
> ࿊> wouldn't make too #>
> ࿊>         much sense.  
> ࿊> #>             >
> ࿊> #>             > On 2017-02-18 21:49,  
> ࿊> lorenzoiannuzzi AT gmail.com  
> ࿊> #>             <mailto:lorenzoiannuzzi AT gmail.com>  
> ࿊> wrote:  
> ࿊> #>             >> For people whom don't prefer IRC,
> for ࿊> what ever reason,  
> ࿊> #>             nor forums, we have a  
> ࿊> #>             >> solution for you,
> ࿊> #>             >>
> ࿊> #>             >> Join the unofficial Discord at:  
> ࿊> discord.gg/bCKFkN3 #>
> ࿊>           <http://discord.gg/bCKFkN3> today and
> ࿊> receive,  
> ࿊> #>             >> - Real Time Chat
> ࿊> #>             >> - Work Group Discussion
> ࿊> #>             >> - Voice chat and more.
> ࿊> #>             >>
> ࿊> #>             >> Join Today at discord.gg/bCKFkN3  
> ࿊> <http://discord.gg/bCKFkN3>! #>             >>  
> ࿊> #>             >>
> ࿊> #>             >>
> ࿊> #>             >>
> ࿊> #>             >>
> ࿊> #>             >> --------
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